John Proctor of the Salem Witch Trials

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Dragon Sage007
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John Proctor of the Salem Witch Trials

Unread postby Dragon Sage007 » Fri Nov 18, 2005 6:15 pm

Yes, John Proctor. Me old thirteen generations removed uncle, the one who they say managed to stop the Salem Witch Trials. Any information you can give about him would be useful, and I will be giving back a good result! However, there are some...qualifiers.

-Nothing from the movie The Crucible. I've already gone through it with a fine-toothed comb, and found the truth and the Hollywood lies.
-Names will be useful if you have them, none of the 'this judge' and 'that maidservant' stuff.
-Ages will be largely ignored. Give 'em if you want, but be warned, I probably won't even see it.
-None of the stuff in the list below.

-John Proctor was around 60 when the trials began. Abigail, around 11. And yes, they did sleep together. Once.
-John Proctor owned a tavern. There was another man in Salem who owned a tavern, whose name I don't recall offhand, and he would not have stood in the way of Goodman Proctor getting hanged since only so many booze barns could exist in the state at any given time.
-Giles Corey will be ignored utterly. Even though I admire Mr. "More Weight!" and am rather irked at him at the same time.
-Um...some more stuff I'll put in later. To be updated!

I'll also add in more stuff later. I'm doing research on my own.

To Goodman Proctor, the man with the supernatural ability to see through bullshit and was hanged for it. <p>
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Re: John Proctor of the Salem Witch Trials

Unread postby Idran1701 » Fri Nov 18, 2005 11:39 pm

I don't have any information, but it looks like Wikipedia could use some as well. Their article's entirely on Miller's version, and it's tagged as low quality as is. You might want to think about putting together an article for them as well once you get all your stuff together, for future reference by others into this subject. <p>

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Capntastic
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Re: John Proctor of the Salem Witch Trials

Unread postby Capntastic » Sat Nov 19, 2005 2:50 pm

I played as John Proctor once in a classroom presentation of the story. Does this make me related to you?

Also: Totally awesome stuff. I can't wait to see what comes from this.


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Re: John Proctor of the Salem Witch Trials

Unread postby Zemyla » Sat Nov 19, 2005 4:02 pm

I played the sheriff! Yay for having only a few lines! <p>-----
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Re: John Proctor of the Salem Witch Trials

Unread postby SALSAlys » Sun Nov 20, 2005 5:14 pm

Awesomeness and good luck on this. Unfortunately, I cannot help more! Being as all I know comes from that play.


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On that play...

Unread postby NamagomiMk0 » Sun Nov 20, 2005 7:57 pm

I fucking hated it. Didn't help that the teacher who was going over it in my American Lit class effectively harped on about the Puritans every other minute.

For an entire semester.


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Re: On that play...

Unread postby Dragon Sage007 » Mon Nov 21, 2005 2:18 pm

Huh. Guess I'll be doing this stuff by my lonesome, then. :{{{

By the by, Proctor's wife, Elizabeth? She was pregnant with another man's baby while Johnny boy was in prison. Just so you know. <p>
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Re: On that play...

Unread postby SALSAlys » Mon Nov 21, 2005 2:33 pm

You are edumucational!


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Re: On that play...

Unread postby Dragon Sage007 » Tue Nov 22, 2005 4:25 pm

Hm...here's a bit of information I'd like.

If anyone can find an illness, physical or mental, that fulfill the following criteria, as well as give me some idea of how it could be contracted, I'd be much appreciative.

-(Possibly highly) Contagious
-Causes fainting spells(Or shortness of breath...)
-Causes hallucinations
-Causes laughing fits

I -believe- that's all. It seems to be all that's recorded, and I want to see if an actual illness started this madness. <p>
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Re: On that play...

Unread postby Capntastic » Tue Nov 22, 2005 6:08 pm

I've had fevers that cause those.


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Re: On that play...

Unread postby pd Rydia » Wed Nov 23, 2005 12:14 pm

I'd ask a doctor or grad med student about the illness side. Don't think you'd get much good help on that, here. More detail would be useful, as well, given that four symptoms--well, four symptoms can overlap in any number of illnesses. The context would be useful. <p>
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Re: On that play...

Unread postby Archmage144 » Wed Nov 23, 2005 6:13 pm

Mental illnesses are not contagious, and what you're describing to me sounds like some form of schizophrenia, at least as far as hallucinations, "laughing fits," and other muddled consciousness goes.

As Zero noted, a high fever can cause delusions and loss of consciousness, and there are plenty of transmittable diseases that can cause that. Given the era and whatnot, I'd say scarlet fever would be high on that list.

Dunno what else. I don't personally feel qualified to diagnose the disease of someone who died a hell of a long time ago with only a secondhand account of symptoms and a half-assed understanding of medicine. <p>
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Re: On that play...

Unread postby pd Rydia » Wed Nov 23, 2005 7:25 pm

You know, the first thing I started to type in my above post was "mental illnesses aren't contagious," but then I stopped. As: (1) plenty of physical illnesses (or pure exhaustion) can cause symptoms of mental illnesses--but before the causes are known to be physical, the illness is attributed to demons, or personal failure, etc., and (2) there's quite a bit of evidence pointing to links between viruses and mental illnesses.


Behold the power of quotes!
<small>We hardly think of syphilis as a mental illness today, but patients with syphilitic infection of the brain can suffer hallucinations, delusions, and mood changes not very different from those seen in bipolar disorder and schizophrenia. An early-tewntieth-century psychiatric text describes the mania-like excitement that was sometimes seen in persons with central nervous system syphilis: "The intensity of the excitement is extreme; there is absolute sleeplessness [and] incessant restlessness. The grandiose delusions are the controlling feature of the paretic's thought. The patient . . . comes before us tremulous with emotion, his eye bright, as the overpowering visions of wealth and grandeur float before his mind."[7] The discovery of reliable and effective diagnostic techniques for general paresis of the insane--unfortunately, arsenicals had little effect on the advanced central nervous system disease--was seen by many as an enormous advance in the understanding of psychiatric disorders. Clinicians charged with the care of psychiatric patients had great hopes that the causes of other psychiatric disorders would soon be found.</small>
Also (long quote ahoy):
<small>For many years there has been great interest in the possibility that viruses are in some way connection tp the development of psychiatric illnesses. Most of the work in this area has focused on the role of viruses in the causes of schizophrenia, but there is growing interest in the possibility that viral infections may have something to do with the causes of bipolar disorder as well.

Links between viruses and psychiatric illness have been sought in several different ways: (1) examining birth records to determine if persons with psychiatric illnesses tend to be born during times when viral infections are more common, (2) doing autopsy studies to look for virus particles in the brains of individuals with psychiatric illnesses, and (3) testing living individuals for immunological evidence of viral infections. All three of these methods have revealed the possibility of a link between bipolar disorder and certain viruses.

It has been well known for many years that persons with schizophrenia are somewhat more likely to have been born in the winter and spring months when viral infections are more common. A number of studies also suggest that there is an increased incidence of schizophrenia in children born during times of higher than usual rates of influenza, measles, and chicken pox. It has been suggested that viral infection of the developing brain during the third to seventh month of gestation may somehow lead to the development of schizophrenia in some people. Several studies have found that individuals with bipolar disorder are more likely to have been born in winter, suggestion that prenatal viral infections may have some role in the later development of bipolar disorder as well.[8]

Testing for evidence of viral infections by looking for viral DNA and RNA in the brains of individuals with bipolar disorder has become possible with the development of sophisticated biochemical techniques that allow tiny amounts of viral genetic material to be isolated and identified. As you probably know from the news coverage of criminal trials, DNA and RNA are unique molecular "fingerprints" that can identify individuals with great certainty. DNA and RNA can be used to "fingerprint" viruses in the same way. DNA and RNA from certain viruses have been found in the brain tissue of persons with bipolar disorder but have not been found, or have been found in lower concentration, in control subjects. These findings provide additional evidence that viral infection may be involved in some way with the development of bipolar disorder, at least in some individuals.[9]

A third method of investigating the possibility that viral infections are involved in the development of bipolar disorder is to test for antibodies to viruses by means of a blood test. Most blood tests for viral infestion, such as tests for HIV and hepatitis viruses, don't actually test for the virus itself but rather for chemical defenders called antibodies that the body produces in response to a viral infection. Each type of antibody is shaped precisely and uniquely to fit the invading organism that promted its manufacture. The presence of antibodies to a particular virus in the bloodstream indicates that the body has encoutered that particular virus before. Researchers using this approach have been investigating possible links between bipolar disorder and an animal virus called the Borna disease virus.

Borna disease, an illness that usually affects horses and sheep, is cuased by a virus that invades the brain and meninges (the covering tissues of the brain) of the animal and causes progressive deterioration in brain functioning and, eventually, death. The virus is not known to cause human illness, but antibodies to the Borna disease virus have been measured in healthy humans. Although most animals infected with the Borna disease virus develop the rapidly fatal brain infection, some laboratory animals experimentally exposed to the virus have been observed to develop a persistent but low-grade infection that does not cause rapid death. Some of these animals develop behavior changes that bear some resemblance to bipolar disorder: periods of overactivity and of progressive apathy and withdrawn behavior.

There have been a number of studies testing mood-disorder patients and control groups for the presence of antibodies to the Borna disease virus. Several of the studies have found that a higher proportion of the mod-disorder patients have these antibodies compared with the control subjects.[10] This suggests that, in some patients at least, a virus similar to the Borna disease virus may contribute to the development of mood-disorder symptoms. Perhaps there is an interaction between viral infection and genetic vulnerability that can result in a mood disorder. Other illnesses are known to result from this interaction of genetic vulerability and viral infection. For example, insulin-dependent diabetes, the severe form of diabetes that usually has its onset in childhood, is believes to occur when a combination of genetic facotrs and a viral infection brings about an abnormal immune reaction, causing the destruction of the insuling-producing cells of the pancreas. Perhaps a similar mechanism operates to cause some cases of mood disorders.</small>
Both excerpts from:
Bipolar Disorder:A Guide for Patients and Families
Francis Mark Mondimore, M.D.
ISBN 0801861187




Sidetracking aside, I repeat sentiments from my previous post. There's a reason why the medical profession is so highly specialized, and sub-specialized, and sub-sub-specialized. And when you find a good doctor, you tie them to the fence and never let them go. Ever. <p>
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Re: On that play...

Unread postby Dragon Sage007 » Wed Nov 23, 2005 8:52 pm

Really? Damn. I suppose I should've kept Dr. Koff, then, instead of letting him loose in the park with all the other old doctors. He looked so happy though, doing his doctor thing with all them other old guys, instead of starving by my rickety fence. Despite his attempts to break it down.

Seriously though, Diane wins a freaking cookie. No, she wins an entire ovenful of cookies. =D
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Re: On that play...

Unread postby pd Rydia » Thu Nov 24, 2005 11:56 am

Was that useful? Neat. I thought I was just arguing with Brian. <p>
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Archmage144
 

Re: On that play...

Unread postby Archmage144 » Thu Nov 24, 2005 5:49 pm

What Dia says is true. Some communicable diseases do have long or short-term neurological effects, though I think that most psychologists would probably be referring to the classical mental illnesses (as I was) when referring casually to "mental illness." However, since "mental illness" are so poorly understood to begin with and the existing theories explain so little, I'd say that the idea of a communicable, pathogenic cause of at least some mental illnesses or "mental illness-like symptoms" is totally plausible.

After all, if synthetic chemicals introduced via a capsule or other manufactured dosing mechanism can alter the human brain chemistry and function, I guarantee there are some bacteria or viruses that can do the same.

However, when I said "mental illnesses aren't contagious" I was saying so in the simplest terms that I (and, as I see it, most people) understand. In other words, you can't catch schizophrenia or bipolar from hanging around someone with the disease or by frequenting mental wards the same way you can catch a cold, or even with more intimate contact, as with HIV. <p>
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Re: On that play...

Unread postby Zemyla » Sat Nov 26, 2005 12:56 pm

On the same note, ergot might have caused it all. <p>-----
Do not taunt Happy Fun Zemyla.

<span style="font-size:xx-small;">I think boobs are the lesser of two evils. - Inverse (Pervy)
Dammit, Dan, I'm not dating a damn NPC! - OOC Will (Will Baseton)
Of course! Anything worth doing is worth doing completely wrong! - Travis English
Ultimately, wizards and clerics don't say, "Gee, I want to become a lich because weapons hurt less and I don't have to worry about being backstabbed; that whole 'eternal life' thing is just a fringe benefit."-Darklion
But this one time I killed a walrus with my bare hands, and I suddenly understood spherical coordinates. - KnightsofSquare
Also, when you've worked a 36-hour shift as an intern you too just might pour yourself a catful of coffee and sit down to cuddle with your travel mug. -eirehound
</span>

Adventurers! | RPG World World | The Phantom Lord's OT Board mkII | Indie Madnesse | Brotherhood of Elitist Bastards</p>


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